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Sunday, October 20, 2013

Facebook Follies - part 27

There is some debate going on about the ACA, also known as "Obamacare".  Of course Obamacare will contribute to the bankruptcy of the United States.  It won't do as much damage as Medicare or Social Security, or Bush's Medicare Part D, but it will simply speed up the train as it barrels toward the burning trestle.

Someone who sits in the 1st pew of the Church of the State took my and someone else's free market (and hence negative) views of the program as sacrilege  - he was OFFENDED.  In the below exchange you'll see how logical fallacies, logical leaps and poor attempts at obfuscation rule the day on Facebook.  Unfortunately for this person, he ran into a buzzsaw - me.

FS and I agree on the moral reprehensibility of the ACA.  NLB loves his masters, God - oops - government will heal all, and it is the beneficent overlord of the economy as well.  I used to be surprised that people thought this way, but I am naive no longer.  Take a look:

FS -  What I would like, is for the position of "hey, let's not force each other to do things" to be recognized as a legitimate human right and not be chastised as being a crazy extremist position. Especially when I am caught between two factions: one that wants to take my money and throw it TO people they do like and the other which wants to take my money and throw it AT people they don't like.

Mr. M - Mr. S you are correct, but you're going down a thoughtful path that many cannot understand as they've been addled and bamboozled. In order for healthcare to be a 'right', then you make healthcare workers slaves, as they are forced to provide their services as one has a 'right' to those services. The free market works, is has worked, but one must go back (in US history) at least 100 years to see even a facsimile of such a market. Once the AMA and the Rockefeller foundation got its claws in the medical establishment, the downward cycle began.

(side note - I was thinking of this article when I wrote this.  I will add italics to NLB's intellectually limited response)

NLB - I guess we'll all find out soon enough how monumentally the ACA destroys the good and pure market system I suspect we'll be just fine.
And Dcm, Last I checked there were plenty of major crashes pre-1900. Check your history. It's only in the highly market regulated 50s-70s that the boom-bust cycle took a break.
LOL the only country in the world where people talk like this, as though we're all goddamn mercenaries and everyone else can go f*** themselves. It's truly our national religion. "Yeah, screw the greater good." Rah rah, America. *sigh*
And yes, you are aligning yourself with a very common political position, FS, all assertions to the contrary.

MR. M - "check your history". Ok. I think I will, but only if you go through the reams of evidence that show that the business cycle is affected only by gov't intrusion. The boom / bust cycle is caused by 3rd party intrusion - it's why the French, when asked by the gov't officials 200 yrs ago said 'laissez faire' - let us be. I suggest von Mises' magnum opus, "Human Action", where he demolishes the views you seem to have adopted. Another good choice is Murray Rothbard's "America's Great Depression", where he showed that the FED and the US Treasury caused the Great Depression by the artificial expansion of credit. It's why you never hear of the Great Depression of 1921, because the federal gov't did....nothing and it was over in 18 months, and the downturn post WWI was worse than the one in 1929. Rothbard's "Man, Economy and State" is if you want the full monty, and not just an isolated American study. You can also go through Isabel Paterson's "Ghost in the Machine" - a great read, written in the WWII era when her views were unpopular. Albert J. Nock's "Our Enemy, the State" will, if you're looking for an analysis of the 17th and 18th centuries, do the job of showing you how government is the enemy of the people. For the 'happy ending' you can go through Carroll Qugley's "Tragedy and Hope" (B Clinton's mentor - mentioned by name in his DNC acceptance speech in 1992) for an insider's view of how the Big Banks have been intruding and, via the Morgans, Rockefeller's et al, taking over what was once a free economy and a free people. He wrote it after having 2 yrs of access to the papers of the CFR. Of course they broke the plates because it caused such a stir, but that's just coincidence.

It was the "check your history" comment and the "It's only in the highly market regulated 50s-70s that the boom-bust cycle took a break." comment that made me write all of that.  Telling me to check my history is one thing, but the 50's - 70's is purely odd, as 2 minutes of analysis blows it away.  Our economy now is multiple times more regulated, and we have no vestiges of a gold standard, and our boom bust cycle is out of control.  The guy makes no sense.  Notice the arrogant *sigh*, as NLB takes the pseudo high road, after making so many unfounded assumptions about freedom and the free market that his response becomes a parody.  FaceBook is usually not worth it to go bananas like that on someone, as he won't read any of those things, but there might be an enterprising person, or a critical thinker who will, and then it is worth it.  In the space below I posted this link, not for NLB, but for one of the Remnant

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